nzjetboating Web Board.

nzjetboating.com Forums => Projects => Topic started by: Warwick Marflitt on December 31, 2020, 09:38:23 AM

Title: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on December 31, 2020, 09:38:23 AM
So Ooh Ah has had a leak and twice the reverse bucket wouldn't couldn't work! 1st time couldn't back off the trailer, cause was the too shorter self-tapping screws holding the morse cable mount had pulled out of the wooden plate someone used to secure it... The  second time I couldn't stop(no reverse) and ended up on a log and gravel, cause was that the wooden plate holding the morse mount I fixed to it, had come off the transom!!! WTF
 On closer inspection it was only held there with a roofing tek-screw....Other peoples engineering eh! Yes I probably should have looked harder and suspected more issues? I just didn't consider the Ninglephut factor as much as maybe I should have. So this week has been find the leak week! Boy did I find the leak..... A shoddy hidden glass repair... under the engine revealed the cause... Engine out patch ripped off grinding out the de-laminated glass ready for some new solid epoxy and cloth.     
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on December 31, 2020, 10:04:04 AM
 The good thing OoOoO was that under the patch/slab/ornamental biscuit was the original serial number HJ53/165 Have a few loose exhaust manifold leaks(loose bolts) Rocker cover gasket oil leaks so will do a full bolt check replace gaskets fit new reverse bucket and should be a good old boat once fixed and back together. Some would say to strip it and put into a new alloy hull but where's the fun in that? :o Itch..... :-X scratch.... hang on I gotta shower and change ma clothes.....
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on December 31, 2020, 10:49:38 AM
Good opportunity to pull the pan off of the donk and have a wee look inside? I am stuck waiting for the auto sparky to open- the gauge cluster and assorted items (wideband, bilge pump, etc) are frying themselves - think we have a bad short which is frustrating as the engine is running nicely. I have an oil leak as well so may yet pull my engine out if I can't sort it in the boat.
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on December 31, 2020, 10:53:42 AM
>>@ aAe
      Here's the mounting block they'd used. The screw was thru the fiberglass transom head was burries under Silly-Con which is what it is when used like it was.....
I will replace with Hi Density Plastic and stainless bolts washers and loc-nuts going thru transom to sandwich the lot in place for 99.999% reliability. Have new gaskets for leaking loose exhaust Manifolds.... Heaven forbid if you had fuel vapours in bilge and flames fl. flashing past loose Manifold gaskets... Happy new year all b> 
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on January 30, 2021, 20:44:15 PM
 jaw So I dug a bit deeper and the hole got bigger until all the osmosis, cracked, oil soaked old Fiberglass was removed. This will be a double sided repair with Wests 105 Epoxy and slow hardener. Using double bias mat and chopped strand that's epoxy friendly
(With no styrene).....
Strung the now empty boat off the tractor loader for a day of a Hot day of mayhem....
Lots of grinding hull outside in a paddock and on a windy day. Drank 2 liters of water and with 3 layers. 1st clothes and a pare of milking gloves and gumboots, 2nd overalls with taped up arms,legs over gumboots taped and neck. Then 3rd layer, full paper overalls, respirator, hood glasses and a visor. I plugged in 80 Grit discs on grinder and  Tore into it......!!!   
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on January 30, 2021, 21:14:36 PM
 I survived *-) No Itching  OoOoO . We want to use the boat so I will pull the jet unit when I get another aroundtooit time slot..... I probably should do it but we have a lake side hut booked in a few weeks time so I have too stop somewhere for now....   
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on January 30, 2021, 21:42:26 PM
Looks like I have a broken grill bolt to remove Rear LH one sl Ship happens I guess....
Here's where the Reverse cables mounting blocks attachment screw hole was..... Check your Steering system, throttle pedal, linkages, return springs n cables, Reverse bucket, mounts, levers, pivots and or cables rose joints. I reckon that a pre-flight kinda inspection. Before boating and  again if you have a Bump out on the water.... Maritime NZ/Police ect will have your bits in the vice if they can prove that you where a negligent Captain! Not knowing the rules isn't a defense anymore... Will show progress as it gets done.....   
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on January 30, 2021, 22:17:44 PM
Funny how once you get into these jobs they take on a life of their own! She'll be a 1000 times better once you lay up a nice thick keel again. Good job mate!
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on January 30, 2021, 23:02:40 PM
Yes she's a great bit of fun alright. Might fit one of them Keel guards to add a bit more protection? Although it might channel air to the intake and make it harder to slide it around on the gravel....  Cheers Kakapo Hows the Carby V6 Honda going?
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: steelo on January 30, 2021, 23:19:11 PM
Good on ya Warwick. Very pleasing to see other people taking time and care to do a GOOD job. I have seen YT videos where they drill holes all along the sides of the repair. Glass fibre and resin flow into the holes and sort of stitch it together. Keep up with the pics.
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Jimmy Jet on January 31, 2021, 08:55:51 AM
Nice job Warwick. Had you considered a bisalloy / hardox type skid plate along the keel?
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Paul on January 31, 2021, 09:55:49 AM
If you take a belt-sander and blend the hull-to-inlet-face transition, you will see good gains - essentially adding a 'spoon' that force-feeds water into the jet.  Mark out ~50mm either side of the line where the faces meet and blend it out (- need to add GRP to the inside of the hull to make up the thickness removed).
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on January 31, 2021, 16:54:08 PM
Nice Job Warwick...great repair for a great boat...im sure you'll make this look great!
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on February 02, 2021, 14:57:08 PM
Cheers Kakapo Hows the Carby V6 Honda going?

I Will let you know Monday night- just got a care package from Summit Racing USA today- new rpm switch and wideband, so now the electrical stuff is sorted I can finally wake up the vtec and see where we are at. Looking forward to a blat up the Waimak on Waitangi day.
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 02, 2021, 19:21:35 PM
So before I commit to the Fiber-glassing. Should I change the bottom shape? My only reasons for this is that obviously the point of the delta gets all of the force and wear.
If I replace what I have removed It's a patch made up of differing thickness and area. If I cut out a uniform Triangle and fit a new symmetric section of hull with a slight curve as my drawings show?
My main concern is that I might be introducing Hook into the hull and I'm decreasing the displacement/Buoyancy of the hull under the heaviest area of the hull? Lastly is that I have made a mongrel out of the original HJ53 hull shape....! All and any Honest views appreciated. No ego to bruise here! I just need to get it right first time....Thanks in advance Warwick       
Title: Re: Other peoples Engineering
Post by: Tones on February 02, 2021, 20:27:42 PM
Something for you to consider. Instead of a flat delta it may be easier to round the keel like the J73. The result could be that it gives nothing away from the ride without buggering a boat. Another plus would be that it would be the only 53 that splns. ;D
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 03, 2021, 19:50:14 PM
 :o :o :o Well I've gone and done it now  >>@

Where ever there's a problem, there's an A-do....
And the bigger the problem, the bigger the A-do......
What gets Bigger the more you take out of it????
A hole......
 
It was still full of fractured Fiberglass. So It's
really the only way forward. And I think it'll be easier
to lay up a uniform shape and stronger If I do it right...
I will use some plastic sign board with PVA mold release
to build the inside layers on. Then flip it over and do the bottom
I will keep it pretty much standard and smooth/spoon the edge before
the intake to get better flow into unit as Paul recommended....
A shame I wasted time sanding BUT! It was better to go in easy first
and see what was in there......   
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 03, 2021, 21:23:57 PM
So now I have a uniform even thickness substrate to build the new fiberglass on.

My HX has seen better days. End plates corroded, brittle and o-rings, thru rod shot... so I'm making a 3 meter 20/40mm underfloor copper pipe JBNZ special Heat exchanger
cheers for all of your comments, advice and encouragement gents always appreciated....

Old HX Post....

https://www.jbnz.co.nz/yabbse/index.php?topic=20300.0
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 04, 2021, 08:56:34 AM
Fiberglass lay up will be like this. The Veed Black is the original hull, ground back to a taper at a ratio of 12:1. The green inside  will be layers of Bidirectional and chopped strand mat.... the Yellow outside being the same..... All Fabric will be pre cut to size before mixing Epoxy and icing the cake...... It will be great to get this done....

All this fiberglass info was in this free PDF
https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.westsystem.com/wp-content/uploads/Fiberglass-Manual-2015.pdf&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwjV2quuv87uAhXF4zgGHVUlDsUQFjABegQIChAB&usg=AOvVaw03m0liL_bGhmOP6JQoEuCL
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jimmy Jet on February 04, 2021, 10:07:31 AM
Good stuff Warwick. Nice repair. Any thoughts on a bisalloy skid plate I mentioned earlier?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: steelo on February 04, 2021, 15:46:47 PM
Drill the holes. Or at look and see if it?s an option. That way both layers bond / join through the hull.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: hamjet41 on February 04, 2021, 16:50:36 PM
Wow! Good job Warwick and really interesting following the 'seek and you shall find, then do' approach to the FB problem/solution journey to date.

 B))T B))T B))T B))T 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 04, 2021, 23:38:11 PM
Jimmy Yes.... There's a few other options as well. Ultra-high-molecular-weight polyethylene (Plastic) or maybe a Keel guard. You can Mix graphite powder in epoxy for slide properties or aluminum powder or Silicon Carbide can be mixed into the epoxy top coat for wear resistance. Drilling and bolting a bisalloy plate on is a big job and puts holes into my new hole replacement FG bottom... I think that as I'm glassing it I may as well add the carbide and see how that goes. It's been done before

http://www.jbnz.co.nz/yabbse/index.php?topic=4926.0

Steelo.... Drilling holes is probably unnecessary.... Epoxy resin forms a chemical bond at an atomic level somehow the chemicals form chains chemically that are tougher than bullets when used with Kevlar $$$$ otherwise I'd use Kevlar mat and epoxy not fiberglass mat... With the 12 to 1 taper the new epoxy has 480 square mm of surface area to bond too... I have yet to see ally with a welding bead that is 480mm wide

Hamjet.... Thanks for that mate.... being an Auto sparky you learn to prioritize the fault finding list! Starting with the easiest tests first progressing onto the hardest last! There's not a lot on here about Fiberglass repairs so It's good to do this and share the task... The Skill saw with Alloy cutting blade chomped thru the glass really nice. I just held the vacuum cleaner pipe next to the blade guard and it sucked away all the itchdust as I pulsed the trigger to keep the cutting speed down and stop heating the glass. The electric wood planer did a massive job tapering the edges as well with Vac hose taped over the ejector port.
No boat work today ()()... Had a leaking water hose under the Tanker track to repair so that was today's task
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 05, 2021, 11:46:47 AM
loving watching your work Warwick .....nice job
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: hamjet41 on February 05, 2021, 13:06:51 PM

Good 'ole Kiwi ingenuity with the '#8 Fencing wire' approach to eliminating FB itch potential on your Skilly and Planner Warwick b> b> b> b> Only ever 'played' with FB as a kid in CHC fixing the kayak for the Wairarapa Stream  O)))) O)))) O)))) with some FB mat and Epoxy and made a shite job  l-l

Silly question time; when you form the new FB (fill in that bloody great hole you have now  cou) bottom, how does the new FB key into the other older FB - obviously you rough it up etc or is there any special to do? The new FB inside and outside hull piece I get but the bond new to old, and overlap is of interest as I follow your project  pop pop pop pop pop pop pop

Not that I would ever FB anything  O)))) O)))) O)))) O)))) O))))

Keep it coming, after the hose repair............ B))T B))T B))T 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 05, 2021, 13:51:58 PM
How good is your chemistry knowledge? O_o Epoxy resin bonds by forming chemically fused chains to bond with the original FG....
It's science and chemistry technology..... If I sink then it'll prove that either my skillset is not up to the task or the chemistry technology doesn't work...
"Who dares Wins"
Backing the FG to lay up the inside is the real challenge so that the outside has a suitable surface to build it on.... Hold the line caller... The solution has been conceived and fabricated. All shall be revealed soon enough....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: hamjet41 on February 05, 2021, 14:38:14 PM

Await with baited breath Warwick. I know your solution will be a winner and if need be adapted to still be one - Nothing Ventured, Nothing Gained.

On chemistry knowledge, I was great at making my own gunpowder  *-) But anything at molecular level............well I was probably trying to blow myself up during those classes  sh fl. hhh







Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jimmy Jet on February 05, 2021, 20:18:12 PM
Jeez Warwick you ask someone how good their chemistry knowledge is then say the backing is a challenge? That's the easiest bit.....Get a piece of corflute sign material and use a hot glue gun to stick it to the outside of the hull. Do your lay up, or the first few layers and then the corflute will just pull off. Brown tape is magic to put on something you don't want epoxy to stick to as well.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 06, 2021, 00:15:24 AM
Jimmy jet. You sure know how to ruin the surprise..... I have to get it in the right place to get the angles and center line right. I'll use PVA mold release and then be lining it with peel ply so that I don't have to sand it before I glass the bottom. I have to sand/plane the 12:1 taper first and that's a lie under the hull overhead job... quicker than flipping the boat tho.... wish I had a turning frame to roll it in....
Granny used to say.  Wish in one hand and s#*t in the other and see which one fills up first..... Oh it's the 6th of February....Happy Bob Marley's birthday everyone.....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 12, 2021, 21:42:01 PM
Bloody water leaks.. 00-. Lucky Big Fergus likes ta dig!!!
There's been some  B))T B))T B))T progress
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 12, 2021, 21:53:30 PM
Had fun getting the Core-flute/signboard in the right place on my own. With hull center-line and curvature just right. Ended up using planks axle stands, Tape and bottle jacks to hold it in place.... Prep and Pre cutting all the glass mat into correct size to allow a seamless flow of resin and swear words depending on how well the layup goes
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 12, 2021, 21:59:42 PM
warwick PM me for some really effective expletives....I have invented quite a few.....threatened a few of my tools with them and boy do they sit up and take notice.... l-l
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 12, 2021, 22:06:34 PM
Copper pipe is here for a replacement HX
I had to straighten the fibers in the double Bias Mat! It had been roughly stored so I pulled all the fibers straight and in alignment so that it will lay up as designed...
I had to modify the scissors blades to cut the Double bi it was sliding out of the blades!   
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 12, 2021, 22:26:50 PM
warwick PM me for some really effective expletives....I have invented quite a few.....threatened a few of my tools with them and boy do they sit up and take notice.... l-l
l-l l-l l-l Yeah Ok. Having Bean an underground auto sparky,,,, I know a few acetylene Bombs n examples that get sh!t moving..... is-not "Name calling ya tools" classed as a kind type off metric Hate Speeks?? 
I never have to say a word to my Whitworth spanners! A simple Glare oh the eyeballs and they get to work on the Land Rover without any fuss! Ever....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 13, 2021, 16:25:57 PM
l-l l-l l-l Yeah Ok. Having Bean an underground auto sparky,,,, I know a few acetylene Bombs n examples that get sh!t moving..... is-not "Name calling ya tools" classed as a kind type off metric Hate Speeks?? 
I never have to say a word to my Whitworth spanners! A simple Glare oh the eyeballs and they get to work on the Land Rover without any fuss! Ever....

You have a landrover?....then I cannot teach you one swearword you don't already know. I did my time on pommy $hit carts called jaguars  pop and learnt every expletive plus invented a few during that apprenticeship.  l-l
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 13, 2021, 22:04:11 PM
You sick puppy! We can hypnotize you with words like Lucas... Leyland and Morris oxford haha.... this is fun...like changing the generator on an Austin van... you know the ones with the sliding front doors? Yeah the one you take the front wheel off to get to the genny bolts... Swift...hey SWIFT.... yeah he's out cold boys.... you can nick the Highlander... Let's see if it hammy turns good!!!!
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 14, 2021, 11:51:45 AM
You sick puppy! We can hypnotize you with words like Lucas... Leyland and Morris oxford haha.... this is fun...like changing the generator on an Austin van... you know the ones with the sliding front doors? Yeah the one you take the front wheel off to get to the genny bolts... Swift...hey SWIFT.... yeah he's out cold boys.... you can nick the Highlander... Let's see if it hammy turns good!!!!

EEEEEWWWWWW!........I used to drive 50k to my first girlfriends house in a Morris thou.....shaked rattled and moved very slowly.....especially for a young fella....(can I say that here?)
I learnt to drive in a Morris 1300.....I shaved my knuckles many times on spinning the rear wheels for a wof on a mini  ($5) back then.
I worked on woosleys, Austin princesses....(yuk) and LADA NIVAs....(worst vehicle ever built I reckon) plus many more pommy $hit carts like triumph etc (although I have a triumph street triple which is awesome) so back to your post....more pics please.... hi-





Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 15, 2021, 15:57:35 PM
So after lots of prep time and getting it all just right!!! Cloth cut etc.... I mixed resin and laid it rolled and mixed and rolled n laid mix lay roll roll roll mix adjust backing as I had an air pocket in a seam :o sorted it out and after 5 hours n 5 layers of cloth and 2.5ish liters mixed epoxy. st.. It got covered with Peel Ply scraped off and left... its a bit wet today we've had 75mm of rain and its still falling  OoOoO OoOoO OoOoO great for the farm and  B))T... Will add pics later....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jeff B on February 15, 2021, 16:27:31 PM
Make sure you open the doors, get plenty ventilation.
Dont want the fumes getting to you  ;)
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 15, 2021, 18:25:04 PM
Make sure you open the doors, get plenty ventilation.
Dont want the fumes getting to you  ;)

I ventilate the shed and wear gloves and a full face mask...id rather do that than breathe in those fumes plus I wear overalls if working with carbon too....really important to not breathe the dust when sanding....especially uncured resin....but then Im a bit of a nana.... hhh
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 15, 2021, 20:30:04 PM
Thanks guys... ff> Yeah all of the above PPE was worn... carbon filter epoxy fume rated mask, double gloves overalls and 2 story high roller door open to the world,stink bugs and moths......
Right here's some pictures
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 15, 2021, 20:47:25 PM
 )1 whats it gunna be... Dancing Bananas or  >>@ Fallen on ma face
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 15, 2021, 21:17:41 PM
So It's looking like a success on the inside layers. Next is the outside 5+ layers. Any uneven bits I'll fill and level with chopped strand then finish with double Bias on top.Then a carbide or Boron Nitrate powder finish....
When it stops raining I'll be able to tip it over. For now I have to make the new copper pipe under floor HX..... Has anyone ever mounted their SAND TRAP outside on the back of the transom above or beside the jet unit? it would eliminate the drain hose and dump sand outside gone n just make it better I think? How say ye!!!     
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: steelo on February 15, 2021, 21:29:02 PM
Have seen sand traps mounted outside. Problem is the intake (water outlet) is usually inboard. I have mufflers mounted outside the hull. I got a one way valve for fresh water inlet  instead of tap but haven?t installed it yet. Did not quite know where to put it.
May I repeat a suggestion I?ve made many time in this place. Use a heavy duty irrigation solenoid to activate the sand purge. With a switch on the dash, you never have to get out of your seat.
Or, do as I do, have it always cracked open a bit. Constantly drains that way. Good luck and post pics.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jimmy Jet on February 15, 2021, 21:52:06 PM
Nice work on the hull repair. With t h e sandtrap I feel in this case function must follow form. Theres no way to pretty up an external sandtrap.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 16, 2021, 20:40:10 PM
Well flipping a boat by yourself is a challenge. It's amazing what you can do with a Tractor,old post, a railway iron... load binders and thinking....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 16, 2021, 21:02:28 PM
So now it's back in the barn. The second phase of repairs continues..... There's a few low spots from Core flute being a bit uneven... with a bit of chopped strand and epoxy in them with the 5 layers of double bias and chopped strand it'll be as good as I can get it..... Cheers guys...
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: hamjet41 on February 16, 2021, 22:51:38 PM
Fascinating to follow your work Warwick. Awesome job B))T B))T

Cheers
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 17, 2021, 10:07:34 AM
Thanks Hamjet
So I pulled the nylon peel ply off this morning and put the wooden bent-edge over the new
bit of glass.... O)))) then the good ole string------line!!! sh sh sh sh sh
It's fixable and adds thickness and strength to the bit that touches first....So a little time and extra product will see it touching the string.... cou
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 17, 2021, 15:19:40 PM
I did position the core flute backing to be lower than the finished surface to allow for the 5 layers that have to be applied to replace what I cut out. the original hull was around 10mm thick. In places it was worn away from previous scrapes and hadn't been replaced when repairs where attempted.... So the adventure continues......   
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kagua84 on February 18, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
I refurbished the centre my J52 a few years ago. The layers of fibre glass were worn through. I had some previous experience with composites and discussed it with an industry expert which I had used for composite issues at work.

He suggested to use aramid (Kevlar) layers with the glass. The final layers had to be glass as the aramid weave and fibres will show through if the gel coat is breached. We also used an epoxy two part resin rather than a polyester resin.

He explained that the aramid works well in combination with other composites, aramid-glass and aramid-carbon can give different properties. The theory was that the layers of aramid would help with impact. I have three teenage sons, so I expected a few minor mishaps, biffs and scrapes that can occur with jetboating. So far we have done nothing that would test the theory as the main uses of the boat have been river and harbour.

I had to take the hull to a workshop as my suburban driveway was unsuitable for the repairs. The cost of the aramid was more than the glass mat, I still have some left in the garage, it's actually yellow in colour. I should have a few photos of the repair which was done a few years ago which I could dig up if you wanted to see them.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 18, 2021, 13:42:36 PM
Thanks for that info Kagua84. I'm using West Systems 105 Epoxy Resin and alternated layers of chopped strand and double bias tape. I'll finish it with epoxy resin and silicon carbide to give it a bit of wear resistance..... To be fair.. the hull was built in September 1973 so it is 48 years old....
More pics. Had to make up a centering device to hold the copper bends for drilling 20mm pipe holes as I don't have a drill press it was the best way to get it sorted.   
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 18, 2021, 14:01:56 PM
 pig
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Swift12 on February 18, 2021, 19:20:38 PM
that copper stuff is sexy Warwick....bet ya can't wait to silphos those together....pics please....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Paul on February 19, 2021, 08:46:38 AM
Had to make up a centering device to hold the copper bends for drilling 20mm pipe holes

That actually pretty clever - kind of like line-boring.

Soo, that was a copper cutter, cutting copper?  How many times did you have to recreate/redo the 'cutter' teeth?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on February 19, 2021, 10:01:40 AM
Really enjoying this thread- nice to see some different skills on display- well done.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 19, 2021, 16:03:42 PM
That actually pretty clever - kind of like line-boring.

Soo, that was a copper cutter, cutting copper?  How many times did you have to recreate/redo the 'cutter' teeth?

No I used it to get the wooden guide plugs, hole the size of the pipe OD. In the picture with the big red watch makers spanner. pop I'm turning the wood around the copper cutter to shave it out to size... The woods a bit of Jara? Hardwood off an old BBQ I was surprised ::) at how well the soft coppers teeth cut it out....
Copper does work harden and the filing and twisting may have had some effect...
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Paul on February 19, 2021, 16:11:28 PM
So what cut the holes in the copper elbows - the teeth on the copper or just used the carbide burr?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 19, 2021, 16:39:57 PM
Back to the fiber glassing.... It's like baking a loaf of vegans certified bread .... lots of procedures and steps to follow to prepare for the main event.... Sanding, finding all and any faults(Air pockets voids or cracked old glass)and grinding them out. Cleaning the work area and not contaminating the area with oily hands, synthetic rags,or bird poop, dust etc....Then! pre cutting all the fabric to shape and in increasing size to get the build up and shape correct. Having enough resin to fl. complete the job in one go....
The job will start with mixing up a brew of thinned epoxy and painting onto the areas to key it for some epoxy thickened with 406 Colloidal Silica and some finely chopped strands of glass fibers.... This will be mixed to a peanut butter consistency and used to fill and level the voids,cracks and low areas.... While these are getting sticky I'll drink lots of water to lubricate my brain so that I won't make any c0H ...
I'll mix up some resin and start laying on the mat alternating with chopped strand and Double bias mat.
5 layers should see it close to the level line then I have the front portion of the bows keel to the main repair to blend into the whole job with a layer of chopped and then a double Bias some woven mat and finish it with a layer of peel ply..... So that's the plan thus far.... then it'll be the silicon carbide wear coat/coats and some paint or graphite epoxy mix as a top coat..... And I'll have to reset the trailer rollers when its all topside up again...       
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 19, 2021, 17:03:09 PM
So what cut the holes in the copper elbows - the teeth on the copper or just used the carbide burr?
A step drill files the carbide burr? and a sanding wheel.... The wood guide was really just for getting the correct alignment.... If I had a pipe notcher it may have been quicker and easier,,,, but soft copper and sharp hole saws grip and deform copper pipe before you can say SH!T.... So a bit of time and measuring got me there in the end and gives you lot something to look at  pop   
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 19, 2021, 17:54:23 PM
Glass mat cut out pattern sorta st kinda it looks better inside my head. The black ovals are to raise the low bit and get it flat. The Red are the new layers for the outside and the Yellow is two top layers of woven mat. It all gets the peel ply on top and then once it cures, Peel off the peel ply leaving a flat textured key surface for The Silicon Carbide epoxy mix too cover and provide some abrasive resistance D_D D_D 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 20, 2021, 08:21:48 AM
Just a note to all about Fiberglass cloths...Take some lengths of clean down pipe to roll it onto. At the shop because if you don't it deforms and breaks/gets weak lines thru the fabric.... I had a really close look and can use this to build up the low center (HOOK)as these are wide enough between the folds giving a feathered edge.... 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 10:10:24 AM
Well to get cool temps and too keep working a wet edge I started glassing at 8pm and finished the following day at 4pm  >>@ NO SLEEP 2 20min breaks..... fl. But it's done pop pop pop.... laying large bits by ya self has a few challenges. But rolled out off bits of down pipe it worked out ok..... I cut lots of short fibers to mix with Epoxy and then thickened with Colloidal silica to make a strong fiber filled boat bog....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 10:20:27 AM
More..... sh sh sh sh Ya'll could have said!!! I now have to adjust the trailer?  l-l l-l l-l ()()
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 10:50:25 AM
 B))T B))T B))T
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 10:52:23 AM
Just how bad was it???
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on February 25, 2021, 12:02:53 PM
Looks awesome mate- that's a big job and you have put in the effort!   *-)
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 13:40:15 PM
 O)))) O)))) O)))) st st st cou pop pop scr sh sh b> b> b> b> aAe
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 14:37:22 PM
So now much too my own amazement!!!! I'm going to put it back together and see how it goes!!! Why you may ask.... Well Id hate to paint it and polish it like new turd to find out that it's no good... So lets see how it goes.... Now who's been thinking... How many hulls could Jiff have welded in the time I spent playing with Glue n glass??? l-l
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Paul on February 25, 2021, 15:20:07 PM
Before you put the GRP away, go over the bottom with a metre+ straight edge and make sure there are no 'low points' (they will really mess up performance when it's the other way up).
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on February 25, 2021, 19:12:09 PM
Yeah thanks Paul... Done it and is 4mm too much over an area the size of you hand?
Easy to fix with some Super Bog  pop...
I don't know what went right but It fits n sits on the trailer sweet as Brew!
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Paul on February 25, 2021, 21:15:05 PM
is 4mm too much over an area the size of you hand

Belt sander (and vacuum/ full body osh gear).
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: hamjet41 on February 25, 2021, 22:52:48 PM
Bloody brilliant Warwick......great job!  B))T B))T B))T )1 )1 )1

Always found it weird the translucent nature of FB as can be seen with the light coming through on the trailer.... puts new meaning to glass bottomed boat  sh sh sh sh sh sh sh sh c0H c0H

Bad pun  I know  sl sl *sick*
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 01, 2021, 18:22:16 PM
Well It's plastic with Glass fibers for reinforcement....!
So the next jobs done and others wait to be discovered found and resolved....
Exhaust manifold leaks plane flat and reseal DONE ...... Next... Driveshaft to flywheel bolts. Ones got a stripped thread!! >>@ but wait there's wayyyyyyyyyyyyy more  C"" C"" C"" C""  O)))) O)))) O)))) cou *sick* no0
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 01, 2021, 18:42:37 PM
It's Exhausting stuff.... hhh

You can see how they've made these wet headers to fit different V6 engines. The exhaust runners from the head flange to the manifold flange are made engine specific and the rest's a set pattern for the VeeSix..... Cheers all 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 01, 2021, 20:27:27 PM
Look and wheap gentlemen  *sick* >>@ sh O)))) O)))) O)))) O)))) hhh no0 c0H
me flexi plates over flexed and I've been lucky and have dodged a nasty failure that would have been bloody exciting halfway thru a rapid or when full to port was needed??? >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@ >>@
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Matthew Feaver on March 10, 2021, 23:12:48 PM
Heck that could?ve been bad. Will you change to a flywheel? Do you find the Flexi makes the engine hard to idle or any downfalls?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 11, 2021, 09:13:49 AM
Hi Matthew. The engine started,idled and ran smooth as. It was low on maximum revs 3500... Ian Colman said it sounded like it was low on one compression and when tested,was 90psi down on cylinder #6 and 40psi on #3 *sick*
So with the low compression and cracked flexplate do I repair (hone new rings and a valve grind) just what's broken? For 179 hp Or do I drop a N/A Barra 182 in for 261hp? And a flat torque curve. Use my wet exhaust logs( one facing forward and one back with a two into one collector to a single pipe? What say ye gentlemen? 2c for your thoughts
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on March 11, 2021, 10:04:41 AM
I love the Barra generally speaking but... its very tall and very heavy. You could go simpler with an Au series 2/3 Tickford at 164 KW (220hp) On a carby and dizzy you need an EA dizzy and they fit into the oil pump drive cover (with a minor mod or two).- or throw in a stock car cam from Kelford cams- (its $150 for them to reprofile your cam) and get a lot more out of it. its a common stock car setup and dead easy to sort out.

There's still heaps of these motors running around today. You can get intake manifolds from Aussie Speed
https://www.aussiespeedshop.com/product/as0012-ford-ohc-6-cylinder-carb-manifold/


Throw on an appropriately sized  Holley and you are away to the races. (I have a manifold, carby and a 2002 Redtop 4.0 etc  sitting on the shelf for the next boat)
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 11, 2021, 11:58:24 AM
For that money I should get an engine loom and ecu. I do like a guts full of carbs and getting dizzy with it... I just have to find a balance between cost, power, extra parts and time. No need  to over capitalize on the project. If i can get an Ecotech V6 series II out of a VU VX or WH Statesman (best of the bunch)
http://www.australiancar.reviews/holden_L36.php
I could run it on my earlier ecu with the MAP sensor using the extra temperature sensor. Then I'll have to make new even space headers to fit and use my wet logs. I'll get around 220hp and some more torques...and my drive shaft will hopefully bolt in and my old mounts and everything else will get used to save some $$$$
Anyone who has or knows of a motor available let me know plz with  a PM....thanks....
BE KIND ;D
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on March 11, 2021, 13:33:41 PM
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/497041231287174/?ref=search&referral_code=marketplace_search
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 11, 2021, 18:07:15 PM
LOL Kakapo.... Wonder if it's had the cam chains done on the GM recall? Looks like its missing the coils off the plugs. Also from memory it revs to 7000 and makes peak power around 5600 so probably wont match my 17 + 19 SS FlowPro impellers at lower RPM... I had looked at these and the single Exhaust port LF1 SIDI engine
https://www.autotrader.co.nz/blog/holden-announces-new-sidi-engines-for-its-commodores
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on March 11, 2021, 18:48:40 PM
As a Ford guy, I happily admit to total ignorance when it comes to GM engines.  cou  )1 Go with the barra- find a green top lpg version and chuck a china turbo on it and make the old girl sing   ff>
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 11, 2021, 19:47:59 PM
Yeah Love the LPG injected taxi engines 12:1 compression ratio. Gas in a boat's a bit scary! You'd definitely need good bilge blower anti static ventilation system and a rice paper cover to explode gently  c0H
I've got a QD32T Diesel sitting in the shed with water to air inta cooler and a big chungho turbo for my old Terrano when I get round tu it.... YEAH-NAH! I just need to stick with what'll work best with most or all of my existing parts.....
 The only thing worse than GOOD ADVICE is.....Not LISTENING too it!!! KISS to make it better  sl sl sl Blah blah blah eh steelo....?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on March 11, 2021, 20:53:50 PM
I hear you. Btw, the reason you get the green top barra is that you get the turbo conrods and valve springs at half the cost of a red top. Run it on 100 octane, keep boost at 10 psi -500hp.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Keltik on March 13, 2021, 08:03:14 AM
My vote would be to throw another 3.8 in there.  You've already got all the hardware to make it work and those motors are ludicrously cheap. I paid $300 for a complete VY motor a couple months ago.

Alternatively you could do some head gaskets on yours?  Pretty easy job with minimum skill required
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jimmy Jet on March 13, 2021, 10:09:52 AM
Agree, go with another 3.8. Easiest way forward. Or splash out on the supercharged one?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Jeff B on March 14, 2021, 09:51:04 AM
Warrick, if you like to spend ridiculous amount of hours on project for little gain,(most of us do) go ahead and swap in a other engine.
Dont even bother pulling the sump or heads off your current engine, take it to the scrappy, and pick up another 3.8 for couple hundred $ and chuck it in.  2c
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 14, 2021, 14:50:59 PM
Lol Jeff. You know what works alright.... The thing is that my engines good cylinders are reading 195psi. So that leads me to think that it's had some work done to it. The difference between junking it without looking inside and having a jackneihaw, more pics for  the post  is some more time 1/2hr with rattle gun and sockets and a box of junk for the scrap yard and I won't die wondering :o.. the least it'll need is a light hone and cleaning the rings for the two low psi cylinders + two head gaskets....some threebond and time....  cou yeah likely story eh? Cheers  and thanks eh!
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Allen M on March 15, 2021, 07:41:26 AM
Warick to help make your decision on whether or not to pull your engine apart you can do a wet compression test to work out whether it?s your rings or valves that are leaking.
With all the plugs out using an oil can squirt a couple of pumps of clean oil into each cylinder then redo your compression test.
If the reading goes up on your dodgy cylinders then your rings are stuffed.
If the reading stays the same it?s your valves that are leaking. B))T
PS  It?ll smoke a bit the first time you start it up but will soon burn the oil off.
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 16, 2021, 09:01:52 AM
Thanks Allen. I'd done that and its not the Valves. I have a set of dashlight bulbs on thin wires that I made up for fault finding looms on mine equipment.... So I hooked one up to a battery and poked the globe in thru the plug holes for a look-see and What I saw p> well its a troublesome picture! But Jeffs junk mans gift idea is THE IDEA..of IDEAS..
For an engine with 1 1\4 cylinders of compression missing it went ok!
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sBhpouCs4c
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 19, 2021, 00:49:45 AM
Scored a vz 3.8 and auto trans with 240 kms for $270.
So will get it sorted and into the boat....
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Keltik on March 20, 2021, 14:12:39 PM
VY 3.8 or VZ 3.6?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 21, 2021, 21:53:21 PM
VX 3800 series II I think? Engine Number VA377113  It has EGR stainless pipe and latest PCV inlet manifold system....
The Trade Me add had it wrong.... Its a Series II Ecotech....

But.... hhh Here's the funny part... I usually "always" never use seat belts to lift out engines. Always a chain.... So yesterday it was just a "lift it off" the trailer onto the ground... no0 And....ummm.. the seat belt webbing, slipped on the tractor bail forks and as the slack belt went tight it SNAPPED!!! and the engine n Gearbox  did a graceful end for end flip in what seamed like slow motion landing on its top. Smashing the inlet hat, Throttle body mount, top runners, bent the fuel rail and one rocker cover.. >>@ So today I'm off to Pick a part $29 for a new Inlet manifold....+ other bits mentioned.....And  So the moral of the story! Is that Seat belts don't safe life's.... Cheers all And at Pick a part was the cleanest looking VX with a low Km engine. But @ $530 for all the bits I'll stick with my bent one lol   
 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Tones on March 23, 2021, 01:03:05 AM
Silly boy, ratchet straps are much better.  00.t
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Ross Goldsack - JBNZ Immediate Past President on March 23, 2021, 10:13:42 AM
Quote
usually "always" never
;D ;D  ;D
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on March 23, 2021, 13:01:53 PM
This might be of interest?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBVlvbnUo2M&t=196s&ab_channel=STREETMACHINETV
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on March 23, 2021, 14:14:53 PM
Tones "SILLY" is a bit of an understatement wouldn't ewe sh say?

Ross.... Ya Always, should never say. Never always should..... Maybe

Geeze that was Silly! I would'a used the engine lifting chain and bolt on lifting Hooks, that are in the Left hand top draw of my tool box... I've had and used them for the last 20 years....... Yeah yeah it's easy ta bee smart n wise after the act-see-dent happened... Well at least no one lost an eye fingers or teeth.... cou 
On the bright side I've removed the lower inlet manifold to replace the Valley Gasket that's renowned for leaking coolant into the oil and I'll check the PCV valve whilst I'm in there. Shall i match the ports???  st
Thanks
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on April 14, 2021, 00:13:31 AM
Quick update... not made much progress with Boat last few weeks. Been to the murderhouse for dental repairs and had a yota 3L diesel to fix crank pulley keyway and cambelt... lining up the ducks and will get it sorted... great day at Matahina dam for the Slalom. Jeff let me try the Honda v6 weapon... Wow! Thanks Jeff a fantastic boat. Cheers all...
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on November 18, 2021, 19:04:43 PM
 OoOoO Well 7months later after lots of farm stuff Deer hunting and other life events I'm nearly ready to get OOH AH back on the water. I've been gathering bits n bobs for the job and done some engine tweaks...
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Kakapo76 on November 18, 2021, 19:17:31 PM
Sweet! Better pull finger to make the cut before Christmas!
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on November 18, 2021, 19:23:10 PM
 aAe  Thanks Kakapo...  B))T withdrawal symptoms suck. There's at least two weeks of work to get it all done I'd say. Cheers all Take care be safe and get ready for your state sanctioned dose of "Te Virass"  sl Knot everyone is jabbed... sh But sure as it rains on a rainy day, everyone's Gunna get a dose off it!  st   Yeah yeah!!! Get back in me shed...... :o



 
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Hondaz on November 19, 2021, 16:53:36 PM
Sweet bucket. Is that a Flo pro?
Title: Re: J53 fixing up Others Engineering
Post by: Warwick Marflitt on November 21, 2021, 21:55:39 PM
Sweet bucket. Is that a Flo pro?

Yes Hondaz aAe it's another  O), fine part supplied by the friendly team at
Harris OoOoO Marine. Great people )1 fine parts n  fl. fantastic service.... Jet boat addicts B))T B))T looking after Jet Boating junkies....

https://www.harrismarine.co.nz/Products/General-Products/Universal-reverse-bucket/